Perpetually funding Gaza

“Welcome to Sunday!” says Ed Stourton cheerfully. “Charities are trying to plug the gap left by the Trump administration’s decision to withdraw funding for Palestinian refugees. We’ll debate the morality of that decision with one of the charities involved - and a Trump supporter.”

That’s a good start. Charities= good; Trump-supporter =bad.

Now I’m going to bore you with a tedious transcription of the whole thing. (It doesn’t do it justice on the page. You need to listen to it to get the full flavour) 

Ed Stourton“It’s half past seven. Still to come in the programme, Anjem Choudary, jailed for supporting Islamic State, will soon be released from prison. Is he still dangerous? A group of charities have declared they’re trying to plug the funding gap left by the Trump administration’s decision to withdraw funding for the support agency that looks after Palestinian refugees. Nigel Varnell is head of marketing and fund-raising for the charity ‘Embrace the Middle East” and Sarah Elliot chairs the London based group Republicans Oversees.  Nigel Varnell tells me how his charity is trying to help. 

Nigel Varnell
Well the last couple of weeks what we’ve seen, or started to see, is the impact of those cuts and originally it’s actually the cuts in US aid budgets before the UNRWA cuts. On of the Catholic health development projects there, Carotass (?) had their funding cut, which means that at the end of this month they were going to close, and they’re responsible for the healthcare of about 6 thousand households in some of the poorest areas of Gaza. So what they’ve done is released an emergency appeal to try and raise 120,000 euros to keep that project going for six months, and what’s happened is that at Embrace the Middle East we’ve been able to find £25,000 of that and the  last time I spoke to them the good news is they’ve also managed to find a good deal more of that which means that that project now at least has bought another six months of its life. 

Ed Stourton
Tiny figures compared to the big amounts involved, aren’t they? What do you think the overall impact of the Trump administration’s policy’s going to be?

Nigel Varnell
Well if you look at the overall impact we’re talking about over 200 million dollars, potentially, of US aid cuts. Also cuts into UNRWA the UN agencies, that could be in hundreds of millions of dollars, we’re already hearing of cuts to hospitals in east Jerusalem that deal with Palestinians and also money for coexistence projects. Now if you begin to look at the impact of that purely in somewhere like Gaza, that might mean something like 500, 600 schools closing; could be 22 health centres in Gaza that might be forced to close, that might be cuts to employment for people who work for UNRWA and maybe another 10 - 12 thousand jobs in an area that already suffers from huge unemployment. it’s going to be very significant.

Now, you may not have the patience to read all of the above densely written tripe. Suffice it to say that the chairperson intervened but once - with a sympathetic, nay, a leading question. 

Contrast that with his disparaging attitude to his other interviewee, the hapless “Trump supporter.”

Ed Stourton
Sarah Elliot, given what we’ve heard, how can you possibly justify this policy? 

Sarah Elliot
Well, for one, America’s not the only country in the world that can give to aid. Um, the Palestinians’ neighbours can step up and give as well, and this is an opportunity for them to do so, and i think Germany has also pledged more money to the region. But, money is spongeable(?) and the problem with giving so much money to that region is that they have a tendency, the Palestinians, to give that money to terrorists’ families who, a family member has either died or been imprisoned or has been injured through committing an act of terror for or on behalf of the Palestinian people, and that’s just not in America’s interest, we don’t want to fund these groups…

Ed Stourton
Well hang on, you’re not funding these groups are you? The vast majority - all this money goes to legitimate aid projects doesn’t it? 

Sarah Elliot
Well, I mean UNRWA has been known to have held antisemitic literature…    

Ed Stourton
Really? 

Sarah Elliot
Yes, they’ve also been known to…..

Ed Stourton 
Really? Can you give me er, er, evidence of that?

          Sarah Elliot

It has been reported on by CNN and (unintelligible) They have stored weapons in their schools, so unfortunately, because it’s a very um politically charged region, money can be moved around in such a way by the heads of these groups or by …. I applaud the gentleman that’s on the phone here for the work that he’s doing.

(Throughout her reply, Ed Stourton was audibly grunting and huffing and making impatient noises in the background)

Ed Stourton
Well let’s hear from Nigel Varnell now, what is your response to the suggestion that this money doesn’t always go to legitimate purposes and is, I suppose, contaminated, seems to be the accusation, by the political nature of the region?

Nigel Varnell
Well the majority of the US aid money actually goes to the development organisations. It goes to organisations, the kind of organisations that embrace the Middle East funds as well, and that money’s not going astray. We’re not talking about money here for the families of terrorists, we’re talking about education for children, health care for sick people. Indeed, the one part of the US aid money that has gone through is money to the Palestinian Authority security services here. But what we are seeing now is cuts to education, healthcare, to job opportunities, and that’s what’s worrying.

 Even though Ed Stourton appeared not to know about the blatantly antisemitic language in UNRWA school textbooks, not to mention their summer camps and so on, you’d think that Ed Stourton would have at least been aware of how Hamas makes use of aid money, (tunnels don’t build themselves, you know) not to mention the salaries with which the Palestinian Authority’ incentivises unemployable Palestinians to murder random Jewish Israelis.

Ed Stourton
Sarah Elliot? 

Sarah Elliot
I just don’t think there’s a lot of transparency when it comes to the money in the UN, which is why the United States has cut quite a bit of funding for the entire UN, and also i don’t think its priorities always line up with America’s priorities, and with this president  who is putting America first, and you know if people are complaining that there’s not enough money, look to another country to supply it. 

Ed Stourton 
Do you think it’s moral to take money back from various projects that have been - people have got used to providing them with health, education and so forth? 

Sarah Elliot
Yes, I think if you don’t feel the money is being used wisely, which I don’t think this administration thinks it is then yes I think it’s fine to pull back from it. And we provide aid - the Unites States is the most generous country in the entire world. Its citizens are, and its government is, so no, I just don’t think pulling money back from an organisation that has not always had America’s first priorities….is a bad thing. 

Ed Stourton 
Can I just point out to you one area where people are suspicious about is which is about the fact that a lot of the money that’s being withdrawn is going to the refugee agency, and there is a view that this is political, that this about trying to remove the issue of Palestinian refugees and their right to return - from the political process.
Is Ed Storton openly advocating for Palestinians’ RoR?

Sarah Elliot
It’s a step in saying that actually Palestine, if you want peace in the Middle East you have to recognise the State of Israel and that the Palestinian Authority is in a united government with Hamas that calls for the genocide of Jews, so I think it is saying um ‘we don’t like the way that you have spent your money, we don’t like the priorities of your organisation, and nor the people in the area.” 

Ed Stourton 
Let me ask Nigel Varnell to respond to that. 

Nigel Varnell
At Embrace the Middle East I would certainly argue that it’s deeply immoral to try and use the poorest and the most vulnerable people in Gaza as pawns in a political game. We’re talking about people in Gaza 80% of whom are reliant upon aid. There’s 40% unemployment…

Sarah Elliot
…and i think it’s criminal…. 

Ed Stourton 
Just a minute Sara Elliot, let him have his say, we’ll come back to you…

Nigel Varnell 
This is an area, one of the few areas in the world where under five child mortality is not going down, in spite of the millennium development goals and everyone’s commitment to those and what we’re talking about is punishing those people. And I was in Gaza in May. I was talking to children, women who had no access to healthcare other than that provided by aid agencies, and to try and say to them that they need to be political pawns in this is completely immoral and I would say wrong. 

Ed Stourton 
And that is what you’re doing, Sarah Elliot, isn’t it? 

Sarah Elliot
No, it’s what their political leaders are doing. there’s no reason why that region should have 80% of their people on aid and i tonic their political leaders are keeping them down in order touch their own political agenda

Ed Stourton
The impact at the moment of what is happening is…

Sarah Elliot
Ok,……..You may not like it

Ed Stourton 
No no, I’m just trying to put this to you please. The people who Nigel Vernall has been talking to are the ones who are going to suffer as a result of this policy, aren’t they?

Sarah Elliot
You know, I hope they don’t, but there are other people that can step in and help take care of them as well, and I think they should look to their neighbours in the region. 

Ed Stourton 
Do you think that’s true Nigel Varnell? I know the British government is very worried about this as well and has increased the amount it has given to UNRWA a bit 

Nigel Varnell
Indeed and Embrace the Middle East would certainly thank DFED and the foreign office for increasing their funding. It’s really important at this stage to show moral leadership and for people to step into that gap, but the argument that other people can fund them therefore we don’t need to, then that surely is an argument that it must be moral to keep funding this kind of aid development projects. We need to keep doing that or people like those I met in Gaza in May will lose their lives, their healthcare, their education and their hope, and arguably that will drive them into the hands of the extremists and make this worse and more unstable for Israel, for Palestinians, for everyone.

Ed Stourton 
Nigel Varnell and Sarah Elliot.

All along, Ed Stourton reinforces Nigel Varnell’s points - rewording them and challenging Sarah Elliot on Varnell’s behalf. 

In his role as ‘anchor’ he appears to be ignorant of vital details - (or is this an act?) and is virtually denying the people of Gaza any ‘agency’ whatsoever - yet not so long ago people like Stourton were insisting that Hamas was ‘democratically elected’ (by the same helpless people).

If the West insists on funding Gaza in perpetuity, they are simply encouraging permanent dependency. If Nigel Varnell is so fond of the people of Gaza he should realise that losing the kind of ‘education’ they are fed by UNRWA would be a step in the right direction. Perpetuating their ‘hope’ (that Israel will evaporate) is another obstacle to a peaceful solution, and as for driving them into the hands of extremists, well, whose hands does he think they’re in now?

Why does the BBC let this kind of biased interview through? Because seen through the BBC’s institutionally anti-Israel prism it seems perfectly ok. 

Note the reply Tweet from 'Helen121' at the top of the page. ‘Educated’ by the BBC, d’you think?